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Re: Longitude of Japan in 20K

From: wbutcher <wbutcher~at~netvigator.com>
Date: Tue, 8 Apr 2008 17:06:49 +0800
To: "'Jules Verne Forum'" <jvf~at~gilead.org.il>

As you imply, the French editions of the Voyages extraordinaires, both the
Hetzels and the modern ones, are a national scandal, with basic errors both
in the facts and in the French, that schoolchildren could pick up. I doubt,
however, that the printers were allowed to amend the published text – it was
their incompetence, and Hetzel’s, after all, that introduced most of them in
the first case.

 

Bill

http://home.netvigator.com/~wbutcher/

1A, Kai Kuk Shue Ha, Luk Keng, NT, HONG KONG

 

  _____

From: owner-jvf~at~Gilead.org.il [mailto:owner-jvf~at~Gilead.org.il] On Behalf Of
BGYKrauth
Sent: 08 April 2008 15:58
To: Jules Verne Forum
Subject: Re: Longitude of Japan in 20K

 

Dear Christian, dear all,

 

o.k., I was wrong to say Verne didn't wrote 137 degrees as it is mentioned
just before in the same chapter. But anyhow West is wrong. And don't believe
that Verne himself corrected this lapse lateron, it was very probably some
printer working on the book or so. Interesting that even modern french
editions do not have this number corrected...

 

Best regards

 

Bernhard

 
 

 

mail from:
 
Bernhard Krauth
 
have a look at:

 

www.jules-verne.eu

 

www.jules-verne-club.de
 
www.bernhard-krauth.de
 
www.bremerhavenpilot.de

----- Original Message -----

From: Christian <mailto:chvsanchez~at~arnet.com.ar> Sánchez

To: Jules Verne Forum <mailto:jvf~at~Gilead.org.il>

Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 6:48 AM

Subject: Re: Longitude of Japan in 20K

 

If we go to the source, for example, the 1871
<http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k1033409/CadresFenetre?O=NUMM-103340&M
=tdm> edition, we can see it is not a mistake, but only some kind of typo,
because Nemo is just repeating the number:

" Monsieur Aronnax, nous sommes par cent trente-sept degrés et quinze
minutes de longitude à l'ouest...
- De quel méridien ? demandai-je vivement, espérant que la réponse du
capitaine m'indiquerait peut-être sa nationalité.
- Monsieur, me répondit-il, j'ai divers chronomètres réglés sur les
méridiens de Paris, de Greenwich et de Washington. Mais, en votre honneur je
me servirai de celui de Paris. "
Cette réponse ne m'apprenait rien. Je m'inclinai, et le commandant reprit :
" Trente-sept degrés et quinze minutes de longitude à l'ouest du méridien de
Paris, et par trente degrés et sept minutes de latitude nord, c'est-à-dire à
trois cents milles environ des côtes du Japon. C'est aujourd'hui 8 novembre,
à midi, que commence notre voyage d'exploration sous les eaux.

Firstly I wanted (just for fun) to think Verne omited the word "cent" on
purpose, as if Nemo did not want to repeat the long number, but it is not
necessary because Verne did correct the error!

 

For this
<http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/bpt6k80464z/CadresFenetre?O=NUMM-80464&M=t
dm> later edition the line

" Trente-sept degrés et quinze minutes de

was changed to:

" Cent trente-sept degrés et 15 minutes de

(note the substitution quinze-->15 so as not to change the rest of the
lines)

 

So I believe it is unfair to keep shouting "Verne's lapse!" when he
corrected himself in later editions.

 

Best regards,

 

Christian Sánchez
chvsanchez~at~arnet.com.ar
Rosario, Argentina

 

 

----- Mensaje original -----

De: BGYKrauth <mailto:BGYKrauth~at~t-online.de>

Para: Jules Verne Forum <mailto:jvf~at~Gilead.org.il>

Enviado: lunes, 7 de abril de 2008 6:34

Asunto: Re: Longitude of Japan in 20K

 

Mike,

 

everything at this Position is wrong. I think it is discussed several times
somewhere else, but anyhow I am going to reply.

 

The original text talks of only 37 degrees (not 137) 15 min. longitude of
Paris and 30 degrees 7 minutes north.

 (I didn't found any french text giving 137, but I have seen english and
dutch textes corrected to it but "West"; a modern german edition also is
writting 137° West, the old ones from Hartleben have it like the french
text. My chineese edition is indicating also 137 degrees, but as I am not
able to read anything then the numbers I don't know if West or East, in my
Japaneese and Korean édition I am not able to find the spot, probably they
wrote it as in the french book in words and not in numbers.)

Paris is 2 degrees 20 min east of Greenwich, so for a modern atlas we have
to add it westerly and substract easterly. So corrected to Greenwich it will
be 39°35' west approx. Looking in the chart we will be here in the center of
the Atlantic, Southwesterly of the Azores some 650 miles...

 

Corrected to the East we will be somewhere on the Costline of Israel,
visiting Zvi Har'El on the cimetary...

 

So consequently this position is wrong and the one or other translator
should haved tried to correct it. You are totaly right that it must be an
Easterly Position, as some 135° West is still close to half the way from
North America to Hawaii...

 

So fixing the position to 137° 15' EAST and correct the Meridian by 2°20'
resulting in rounded 135° longitude EAST we will be (at this latitude
uncorrected) some 400 nautical miles South of Osaka in Japan. So if in
modern editions the startposition should be corrected by Longitude and
direction it have to be 137°15' EAST of Paris.

 

Brgds

 

Bernhard


 

 

mail from:
 
Bernhard Krauth
 
have a look at:

 

www.jules-verne.eu

 

www.jules-verne-club.de
 
www.bernhard-krauth.de
 
www.bremerhavenpilot.de

----- Original Message -----

From: Michael <mailto:hillbillyhobbit~at~hughes.net> F. Duke

To: Jules%20Verne%20Forum <mailto:jvf~at~Gilead.org.il>

Sent: Monday, April 07, 2008 10:37 AM

Subject: Longitude of Japan in 20K

 

I have a really dumb question, which shows my ignorance of navigation, but
here goes:

In every version of 20K I've looked at, the position of the "Nautilus"
some 300 miles off the coast of Japan at the start of her epic voyage is
given as 137 degrees, 15 minutes *West* of Paris. (See pp. 91-92 of the
Miller/Walter Naval Institute Press edition of 20K; page 90 of Bill
Butcher's translation [Oxford World's Classics]; and the French & Dutch
hypertexts in the jvf virtual library.) Shouldn't those longitudes be East
of Paris? Or am I mis-reading something?

Mike

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Received on Tue 08 Apr 2008 - 12:12:37 IDT

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